RAIDING GUIDELINES

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Og.something2do

RAIDING GUIDELINES

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Posts: 681

10/09/07 17:50:06

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MISC RAID RULES:
--Raiding / Groups will be picked just prior to starting the instance
-----Guild calendar sign up feature is permissible but cannot be used to exclude people from joining who had not signed up.
-----Guild calendar sign up feature should be used as a tool to predict who will attend a raid and who might still be incoming.
--Raiding / Groups will not wait for a particular person to form, even if the raid leader is absent
-----If the raid leader is absent, someone in the raid will step up to start the raid in a timely manner.
--Anyone may join into raid selection consideration if rolls for slots have not begun.
--Raid announcement for formation must be in all CAPS and at least 4 times before rolls / selection may begin.
--Anyone who qualified but was "rolled-off" the previous week, has auto-invite for a new raid selection of the same instance the following week. You do not receive auto-invite for a new raid (same instance) during the same week. The reason you do not get auto-invite the same week is to minimize the chances people who can only attend one of the possible times weekly from being more commonly forced out of having a chance to roll to attend. If you were rolled-off for one raid and rolled-in for a second raid (same instance) then your auto-invite status is negated.
--Selected raid members can switch between alts during the raid if:
----- it is to the benefit of the raid (that class is needed for next part), in which case the player returns to using the originally selected toon after the need expires
----- or, the player's alt has a particular need for the next part AND switching to this alt will not cause another member to have decreased chances in acquiring loot based upon original raid selection.
--Substitutions may occur to allow for a certain boss to be beaten (for instance, Illhoof is very warlock dependent). After which, the original player must return, the substituted player must leave. The substituted player must be fully aware of his temporary role in the instance. He will have equal chance for loot on the boss for which he was invited.
--"Midnight Raiders" can continue any scheduled raid that failed to continue or start any scheduled raid that failed to start. If they start a raid that failed to start however, it will continue at the scheduled time (hopefully). If they continue a raid that failed to continue, then those who started just have to realize that it was for the good of the guild that they were permitted to do so. Also... EOE is theirs. And OS and VOA are always up for grabs. Midnight raids are on the fly, and stay off the schedule. We got enough raids scheduled as it is which do not meet their times (recently).

SELECTING RAID MEMBERS:
1. Guild members have priority over all pick-ups (during initial formation of the raid each day -- please do not boot pick-ups who would like to stay or continue from a save to invite an unsaved guild member).

2. Those members not using Ventrilo, as of 13NOV08, can be denied invitation to a guild raid. The raid leader can allow non-Ventrilo users a chance to roll for slots, if the raid leader is willing to cope with the extra typing involved during the raid. If the raid leader decides to allow non-Ventilo users entry, he must open it for all non-Ventrilo users. If the raid leader grants entry to non-Ventrilo users, they are in immediate equal standing with Ventrilo users in terms of raid selection. It is up to the non-Ventrilo user to know the bosses prior to the raid to minimize the typing of boss explanations. At any time during the raid, if their lack of using Ventrilo is determined too cumbersome for the raid, they can be removed and replaced by a Ventrilo user who is eligible considering all other invite rules.

3. All previously saved individuals who helped make raid progress have priority for invite for the rest of that save period regardless of the following rules, EVEN if they are not guild mates. The team is primarily decided on the first trip out, not each individual venture. (For example: if the first team is all available for the rest of the weekend and wish to continue, then only those players will go that weekend for that saved instance... those left out can form another team or join as a pick-up to a non-guild team. If multiple people left the raid then returned, it will be up to the raid leader to determine which of those people contributed the most to the save -- perhaps by a roll-off if their contribution is equal.)

4. You must qualify for the raid based upon the qualification chart or the raid leader will have option to pick another player who does qualify, if available. Two qualifying individuals shall be treated equal REGARDLESS of how much they exceed the qualification amount. Any qualifying individuals will be given full rights to join if eligible under all other rules. The chart is based upon minimum requirements. Your public note will display your eligibility stat after your spec. If you have 1620 DPS after an officer tests you at a practice dummy using your own class buffs, you would then display DPS 1500 in your public note. Once you feel you can qualify for the next step up, get tested again to gain the DPS 2000 status for raid qualification. You must ALSO qualify with the mandatory requirements for that instance as shown in the Mandatory Requirements column, regardless of all other eligibility matches. Consult the DPS Rating Technique rules to determine how these ratings are accomplished.

VAULT 2
(10/25)

VAULT 3
(10/25)

OS +1
(10/25)

OS +2
(10/25)

OS +3
(10/25)

EOE
(10)

EOE
(25)

ULD
(10)

ULD
(25)

TOC
(10)

TOC
(25)

ONY
(10/25)

Statistics
DPS

2000

2500

2000

2500

3000

2000

2500

3000

2500

Statistics HEALER

2000

1800

2000

1800

2000

Statistics TANK (Druid)

34K H
45% DG
DEF CAP

36K H
45% DG
DEF CAP

30K H
40% DG
DEF CAP

32K H
40% DG
DEF CAP

34K H
45% DG
DEF CAP

32K H
40% DG
DEF CAP

34K H
45% DG
DEF CAP

36K H
45% DG
DEF CAP

34K H
45% DG
DEF CAP

Statistics TANK (Other)

28K H
40% AVD
DEF CAP

30K H
40% AVD
DEF CAP

24K H
35% AVD
DEF CAP

26K H
35% AVD
DEF CAP

28K H
40% AVD
DEF CAP

25K H
35% AVD
DEF CAP

28K H
40% AVD
DEF CAP

30K H
40% AVD
DEF CAP

28K H
40% AVD
DEF CAP

Mandatory Requirements

E,FD,FL

E,FD,FL
2 Fr Gear

E,FD,FL

5. Recruit fairly amongst needed class types. (For example: the particular raid you are forming requires 2 TANKS, 6 DPS and 2 HEALERS... and amongst the guild: 3 TANKS, 8 DPS, and 3 HEALERS are available. You must give members of each type equal chance to fill the available slot they match if the above guidance does not already exclude them for eligibility.) Using /random 1-X is a great way to determine who's the extra person or have the individuals in question do a roll-off (1-100) and pick the high rollers.

6. TANKS, DPS, and HEALERS are the only categories for consideration when applying for raid entry. Raid leaders cannot specify at the start of a raid they want X amount of CC, BUT a raid leader CAN sub in other people for a particular boss (a warlock for Illhoof etc) if it proves impossible to complete without that class. After the boss is destroyed, the original raider with rights on that raid must be reinvited to continue with the raid.

7. When someone drops from the raid, an announcement is made in guild chat that an opening for TANK, DPS, or HEALERS has become available. At that time, all the above rules apply for picking the replacement. If you happen to be on a certain boss that needs a certain class to show... for instance you're on Illhoof, and you need a warlock to replace the warlock who just left... all DPS would still roll for the slot, but the warlock would automatically come for the Illhoof boss if desired by the raid leader. After Illhoof is defeated, the warlock would only stay if he was chosen to join the raid as per the above rules (won the roll-off). If the warlock was not the winner of the slot, then the slot would then switch to the DPS who won the slot.

These rules are about fairness, but they also provide a balance of fairness and increased raid success chance... we're all members of the guild and should treat each other as adults. Picking raids in COE is not based upon playing ability, picking favorites, or whims of negligence to the rules. We must follow these rules strictly. Fairness is a #1 priority in this guild. It's not up to the raid leaders to stack their raids so it's the easiest raid possible. If by these rules, your raid has more of a challenge ahead of them, then so be it. If by these rules, your raid isn't as successful as it could have been, so be it. When your raid is formed -- you will treat all members with respect and kindness. We do not invite people to the guild based upon gaming performance, nor are our raids formed in that fashion. If any members of COE are promoting elitism within our ranks, then please bring it to the GM's attention.

LOOTING RULES:

Special rules:
-- If master looter is enabled, capabilities go to the senior ranking guild member. If highest ranks are equal, it goes to the member with greater longevity.
-- Person eligible for Master Looter can delegate the duties to an interested junior member if desired.
-- Person eligible for Master Looter can choose to use Group Loot instead of Master Loot if desired.
-- It is up to the raid leader / master looter to review the equipment for each looter, consider the looting rules, and to ensure members appropriately roll
-- Anyone may pass, but cannot roll then offer your win to another. If you do not want it, you do not roll.
-- Closely examine the item. Consider ALL stats. Initial rolls for the item go to perfect matches for the item, without wasted stats. Armor Type (Cloth, Leather etc) is also considered.
-- Looting Limits for long raids such as NAXX and ULD (to ensure the widest dissemination of loot to as many raid members as possible...)
----- Only 1 Tier piece per raid member per raid ID (unless additional items would go to off-spec rollers or would be sharded...)
----- Only 1 Main Spec loot item per boss (unless additional items would go to off-spec rollers or would be sharded...)
----- Only 3 total Main Spec loot items per raid (unless additional items would go to off-spec rollers or would be sharded...)
-- Looting Limits for short raids such as VOA, OS, TOC, ONY (to ensure the widest dissemination of loot to as many raid members as possible...)
----- Only 1 Tier piece per raid member per raid ID (unless additional items would go to off-spec rollers or would be sharded...)
----- Only 1 Main Spec loot item per raid (unless additional items would go to off-spec rollers or would be sharded...)
-- If the raid leader requests a certain raid member to respec for a certain boss, that individual is eligible to loot for both raid slot types (keeping the looting limits in mind listed above).
-- Follow looting terminology and sequences below if it is difficult to determine loot recipient:

Terminology used for looting sequence:
-- Matching SLOT: refers to raid member categories (TANK, DPS, and HEALER. Members were originally selected for the raid as one of these 3 and remain in this category for purposes of looting)
-- Matching SPEC: refers to the actual Talent Spec of the character. (Some items may be less useful to certain talent specs than to others)
-- Matching CLASS: refers to actual Class of the character (Armor type (Cloth, Leather etc) is a consideration of Class).

Roll Sequence of Looting Eligibility:
1. To roll, SLOT and SPEC and CLASS must match.
2. To roll, SLOT or SPEC must match. CLASS must match.
3. To roll, SLOT or SPEC must match. CLASS does not match.
4. If still unclaimed, ANYONE who can potentially USE it, may roll.
5. If still unclaimed, the item may be sharded (all may roll for shard) or sold (all may roll to sell).

Quick Reference Guide:
-- mp5 items go to healers in roll 1.
-- hit rating items go to healers in roll 2 or 3 depending on class match.
-- crit and spirit items go to healers and DPS in roll 1.
-- expertise items for to hunters in roll 2 or later depending on matches. (Hunters do not use expertise for ranged).
-- warlocks, rogues, warriors, and death knights roll for MP5 items in roll 3.

Rolling for Shards:
-- takes place at each boss. Those that did not win main or off-spec gear or any special item, may roll for shards.
-- all qualifying members roll (1-100)... the top rolls each get 1 available shard.

Optional Formation and Looting Rules (option to use these rules is open to any raid leader):
-- Loot Reservation System: If the raid leader wishes to allow loot reservations in the raid, it can be implemented. They work as follows: At raid formation (does not need to be first day), lootee claims there is only 1 piece left for him to loot in the entire instance. If that piece drops during that same day or raiding, lootee receives +10 on his roll. If the raid carries over to another day of raiding, and lootee identified his reservation on the first day and the lootee participated in both days of raiding, lootee receives +20 on his roll. This can continue for each day the lootee participates. I doubt we'll see one go past +30 as we usually don't continue too many instances for more than 3 days. IF, at any time it is determined that the lootee could receive an upgrade from another piece in the instance, their loot reservation is cancelled. It is only meant for people trying to get that one elusive piece. Keep in mind, this is an optional rule and I don't advise a raid leader to allow for a same day reservation when, for instance, all that was left is KT. Also, it should not be allowed for single boss raids such as VoA, OS, EOE, and Onyxia.

-- Ranged and Melee DPS invite limits: CAN be specified during range formation. A 50/50 ratio must be enforced to where a melee DPS cannot roll vs a ranged member. Also, if there is one available melee slot with the 50/50 ratio instituted with no qualifying guild melee to fill it, a ranged DPS can fill this slot if they also qualify. (The opposite also applies for a melee filling an open ranged slot.) Always take a guild member, even of the wrong DPS type, over a pick-up.) If an odd number of DPS slots are available, the technique used to determine the odd slot (whether it will be filled by ranged or melee) is having all DPS roll for raid entry as normal. You always take the highest numbers as usual, and that odd slot will be naturally filled by a higher roller. For instance... 5 DPS slots are available, two automatically go to melee, another two to ranged. You have all DPS roll... The top 5 rolls are 3 melee and 2 ranged, then the odd slot was won by a melee member. Keep in mind, if for instance all top 5 rolls are melee, you would only count the first three, and the other 2 slots would go towards the two highest ranged. It is not left to the discretion of the raid leader to decide if that odd slot will be melee or ranged -- it must be determined randomly.

-- Penalty for delays to raid: Raid leaders can place a -10 roll penalty (on loot for next boss) to anyone who places a significant amount of unexcused delay on a raid. Yes, it will be a judgement call made by the raid leader. Obviously, DC's will not count. Sorry kids... your parents calling that they needed you to take out the trash is not an excused delay. If the reason for your delay indicates you probably shouldn't have been raiding anyway (had too many things going on) then expect a -10 coming your way. Going AFK unannounced will go far in earning you a -10 as well, regardless of excuse. You announce an AFK, it makes it easier on the raid because then all can break at the same time, which will lead to less breaks later.

Last Edited By: Og 09/27/09 10:24:37. Edited 109 times.

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Og.something2do

#1

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Posts: 681

06/01/08 10:50:45

Comments about Looting Rules:

No changes have been made to our looting system. It's just been rewritten into an easier to read format. These looting guidelines promote retention of new players and fairness to pick-up guests. The reputation of the Circle of Elders can be tainted if these guidelines are not strictly followed. Please adhere to their intent so that our reputation as a fair and mature guild will be maintained.

Some might argue, the missing aspect to our looting system is lack of consideration to our senior / core / frequently playing members. Some guilds encourage preferential looting practices favoring these senior members. Senior / Core / frequently playing members are already rewarded by default in the frequency of instance invitations that they receive. Thus by default, they already have a greater chance to receive loot than those players who play less frequently. To offer additional favor would be unfair to the new recruits and pick-up guests we sometimes rely deeply upon for the success of an instance. All attending members of an instance have equal right to loot based on the guidelines.

Although these rules above are all that apply, please do what's best for the team:
Keep in mind... be kind -- you don't have to roll for an item for which you are eligible. Inspect the gear of your raid members... do you expect them to stick around? That person has your back! If they become stronger, the team becomes stronger and you will benefit greatly from this. If the item only offers you a slight improvement, but the item offers a monumental improvement to another, why not pass on the item to achieve a greater impact on the capability of the guild? Or perhaps you simply won 3 rolls this instance already and wish to share the wealth... but that's it for the kumbayah stuff. This is just a recommendation to show kindness to your fellow members. Obviously you have every right to loot on a item you're eligible for based upon the rules above (1-5) -- you spent 7 hours in the instance just like everyone else. Alts... mains -- it doesn't matter. But please consider these kind words strongly.

Last Edited By: Og 07/15/08 20:04:09. Edited 3 times.

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Pepijn van Scheijen

#2

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Posts: 306

01/19/09 04:20:20

Should have a look sometime at the suicide kings loot system rick. Seems to be a good way to prevent greedy ppl with lucky rolls to get alot of loot.

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Og.something2do

#3

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Posts: 681

01/19/09 13:34:23

i'll check it out buddy, thanks -- just google suicide kings?

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Pepijn van Scheijen

#4

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Posts: 306

01/20/09 04:40:12

http://www.wowwiki.com/Suicide_Kings

wowwiki for all your questions is ofcourse a good place to start :)

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Og.something2do

#5

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Posts: 681

01/21/09 16:11:17

hmmmm... seems very interesting. it would work GREAT for people who are more about the guild... those that are more for the loot and rewards, they may think differently. Either way, our loots system seems towork pretty well. I'll look more into it though... see exactly how it works. Maybe I can modify it for new members / PUG members.

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Pepijn van Scheijen

#6

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Posts: 306

01/22/09 05:19:22

Yeah i know we always had a fair looting system. I never had any complaints. Never tried this system before until i joined this new guild so i figured i would let you know see how your thoughts were on it.

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Jarrod Anderson

#7

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Posts: 56

01/22/09 09:44:03

I think our current looting system is tried and true for us, rarely if ever have any issues or complaints. One of the benefits of being a casual & mature player guild.

And the chart for Raid requirments looks great Rick :)

We had alot of the really good DPS in our Arachnid Quarter Naxx run today... Could very easily complete the whole instance with the group we started with today

Last Edited By: Jarrod Anderson 01/22/09 09:48:18. Edited 1 time.

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Pepijn van Scheijen

#8

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Posts: 306

01/22/09 11:28:35

hey Jerod!

I agree. like i said i have never had any problems with our looting system either. we always tried to do it as fair as possible.
Gratz on your new signature!

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Og.something2do

#9

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Posts: 681

01/22/09 20:38:38

hehehe, ya, my sig is a tad outdated , well, actually, Og still is 70 hehe

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BillyBlack5

#10

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Posts: 28

05/22/09 14:22:44

That Suicide Kings method seems to reward people for taking a break from raiding. While your place in line doesn't go down in your absence, it does move up every time someone ahead of you earns loot. Therefor, when you come back you're at the top of the list while people who have been consistently raiding are down at the bottom of the list since they just earned gear. If it were always the same people showing up, then it seems like it would work fairly well, but not when people frequently take breaks, as is common in our guild.

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Og.something2do

#11

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Posts: 681

05/24/09 15:57:02

hmmm, that would be lame eh?

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Wizdumb77

#12

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Posts: 102

06/02/09 14:31:07

I like they way we lewt

Your Signature ...

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Og.something2do

#13

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Posts: 681

06/02/09 14:52:31

agreed -- i do too, but it could always be improved / tweaked. Today I'm adding the following rules... to fix issues that have popped up lately...

--Elaborating on auto-invites for people who were rolled off for the same instance before
--Elaborating on the 50/50 rule for melee and ranged DPS for when there is a odd number of slots available.
--1 main spec Loot per boss, 1 Tier per raid, 3 main spec items per raid (unless items will be sharded).
--If already received your one main-spec item from a boss, you can not roll for off-spec items on the same boss (unless it will be sharded)
--Elaborating on looting rules for people who respec at the request of the raid leader for particular bosses (will be able to roll for both main spec and spec they switched to... but still must adhere to loot limits listed above)
--Changed healer req for 10/25 ULD to 2000
--Added req separately for Vault 2nd boss, OS+1, OS+2, and OS+3

Last Edited By: Og 06/02/09 15:53:05. Edited 1 time.

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Wizdumb77

#14

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Posts: 102

06/02/09 15:06:15

nail on the head* * *

Your Signature ...

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Og.something2do

#15

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Posts: 681

09/27/09 10:27:22

alrighty -- the new rules have been posted. They mostly came from the forum meeting we had several months ago (Yes, it took me a while to update the rules -- sorry). Here's a link to that discussion:

http://thecircleofelders.com/topic/889?page=4

Also, a few of the changes came from yesterdays meeting where we covered raid formation limits on new raids... and whether or not we keep alts in the guild when people take their mains/alts out. Some of the rules are not in this thread, but various other rules threads that are in the Recruitment/Guild Policies room.

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Bahamuut

For Post Sake

#16

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Posts: 4

01/07/10 11:26:47

Haven't posted yet but thought as a first I would mention that I have been in several guilds, from the worst to what were the best on Dalvengyr. This guild has the most honest and fair raid selection and loot system I have seen to date. Thanks leadership & founders for making such a fair and balanced environment to play in, I love it here!

Last Edited By: Bahamuut 01/07/10 12:17:23. Edited 1 time.

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Jarrod Anderson

#17

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Posts: 56

01/30/10 08:07:12

Glad to have ya Baha :) We like to think we are the best Guild on Dalvengyr just because everyone that "leaves" us to go to another guild whether it be raiding reasons or whatever... 9 times out of 10 they come back to our friendly type environment. We will never be top of the line geared like guilds such as Stalk n Kill but we like to stick with the idea who gives a shit as long as we are having a good time playing with friends.

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Og.something2do

#18

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Posts: 681

02/05/10 21:05:09

here here!

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